Episode 59
FCG059 - Show Business (feat. Chris Fenwick)
10.1.2 is HERE, we briefly discuss it but also layout plans for all new producers of The Grill. We hear from a few listeners and there is a bit of a retraction from last show. Cedric Robinson FCPX Trainer in Melbourne - Cedric labspace.au.com Bullet Proof Red Giant Productions XML folder structure right into FCPX
Download
Featuring
- Chris Fenwick
- Thomas Grove Carter - @thomasgcarter
- Alban Eggers - @eggermedia
Transcription
00:01.840: Alright, welcome to another episode of Final Kai Grill.
00:05.680: This is gonna be a little bit different.
00:07.939: I mentioned on the last show with Eric Weiss that I was leaving town and I I did.
00:13.379: I went out went down to Southern California for a friend's memorial service.
00:17.980: Gordon Fleming, and you can go back to listen to episode I think he was on 45, and then I recapped it again on, I think, 56.
00:26.199: And it was a wonderful time.
00:27.720: I actually put together a m Gordon was a real camera hog.
00:31.560: The guy loved being on camera.
00:33.320: So I ended up putting together a um a a little memorial thing for the service.
00:38.680: And it was
00:39.720: You know, it w it was great and it's it was sad, but um anyway, I kind of promised uh that I pr wouldn't have uh uh shows this weekend.
00:49.240: I missed on Friday because I was on the road and uh
00:52.560: It's Sunday night.
00:53.440: I'm home.
00:54.080: I actually crashed when I got home and took a long nap and got up and I thought, you know, I got a few things I want to say.
01:00.160: So anyway, it was a big deal.
01:01.680: I missed the ten point one point two release on Friday because I was driving.
01:07.759: And I know that everybody would love to, like, you know, hey, let's talk about that.
01:12.320: Let's get an expert.
01:13.439: And we'll probably do that on this coming Friday.
01:17.560: I guess that'd be the fourth.
01:19.560: Okay, another awkward weekend.
01:21.240: I'll figure that out.
01:23.640: So we will get into 10.
01:25.400: 1.
01:25.880: 2, and we're all very excited about that.
01:28.939: I mean, I did um talk with a few people and uh apparently some of the people I'm talking to are are saying that it appears that the uh stability is a lot better than ten
01:39.140: 1011, and we've talked about that on the show.
01:42.100: So I'm actually downloading it right now on one of my machines here in the office, and I'll do a couple of days of little testing with it.
01:50.560: And then I'll put it on all the machines.
01:52.400: That's kind of the way I do things here.
01:56.240: But what I thought today is, and I and I my drive I did was about six hours each way.
02:02.060: And I got to thinking a lot about the show, this show in particular, and also Digital Cinema Cafe.
02:07.340: Now, I will warn you, I haven't discussed this with Alex, but I'm going to pitch it to him when we talk.
02:14.540: But here's what I'm thinking.
02:16.860: One of the things that I really enjoy about this show, oh, and by the way, there's no guest today, it's just me.
02:22.700: One of the things I really enjoy about the show is talking with all of the various people that I get to speak with.
02:30.220: And it is amazing to me how everybody who contacts the show, either through Twitter or email or whatnot.
02:40.020: Everybody's got great input.
02:41.860: Everybody's got great ideas of, you know, like, oh, you should talk to this guy or blah, blah, blah.
02:47.140: And so
02:47.840: I'm going to try an experiment.
02:50.080: And the experiment is this.
02:51.440: And I will admit, this is not my idea.
02:53.440: I got it from the podfather himself.
02:56.720: No, not Leo Laporte, the real podfather.
02:59.940: Adam Curry.
03:01.460: And he and John C.
03:02.980: Dvorek do a show called The No Agenda Show, my favorite podcast.
03:07.140: Although
03:07.840: They're even more prolific than Vinyl Cut Grill.
03:11.600: They produce about five hours a week, and I can't keep up with it, especially since I started making shows.
03:18.400: But Adam Curry, his philosophy is that the audience is the producers.
03:26.160: Anybody who listens to the show is a producer.
03:29.760: And I got to thinking about that.
03:31.920: And I came to the realization that really our audience is the same way.
03:37.520: I'm always getting input from them.
03:39.920: So I am now going to officially dub anybody who's listening to this a producer of the show.
03:46.420: And here's what I ask of you.
03:49.140: I'm always looking for guests.
03:51.140: We're always looking for those great stories.
03:54.280: And you know how to get in touch with me.
03:57.080: Best ways through Twitter.
03:59.160: And I'm going to ask you: not only do you chime in with ideas, but if you don't hear back from me
04:07.040: Hit me again because Twitter can be a little noisy, you know, in terms of signal-to-noise, like, oh, there's so much stuff, and it's easy to let things fall through the cracks.
04:16.080: But I think that's my experiment.
04:20.000: I'm going to try that for a while.
04:22.480: I am referring to the audience of this show.
04:26.020: as the producers of the show.
04:28.260: Now that being said, we've been using the it's called SpeakPipe, the little audio tab on the website
04:35.940: And we're going to go through a few of those right now.
04:39.380: So let's go to the first of our speakpipe audio files, and this is Logan Hyland.
04:46.440: Hi, Chris.
04:47.160: My name is Logan.
04:48.040: I'm an editor out of Arizona.
04:50.040: I recently got back into Fonica Pro 10.
04:52.840: I started using it when it first came out and
04:55.340: Had to abandon it, unfortunately.
04:57.900: I just finished listening to your episode with Thomas Grove Carter, where you guys talk about proxies.
05:03.160: I thought it was really cool and really uh intuitive that he would throw uh proxies into the library and keep those on his actual computer so he could edit on the go and become portable really quickly.
05:15.000: I don't know how to get a hold of him or anything, but I wanted to share with him a product made by PNY.
05:22.560: called StorEdge, and it's either a sixty four gig or one hundred and twenty eight gigabyte SD card that fits just in the side of a Retina MacBook Pro or an Air or whatever.
05:35.300: That you can store files onto and actually work off of it.
05:38.900: I don't know if it's necessarily fast enough for 4K editing, but I thought it was a really cool little thing and might help him with that type of workflow.
05:47.920: Anyways, really, really love the show.
05:50.000: Really appreciate what you're doing.
05:51.920: Keep at it, and thank you very much.
05:55.600: Lived a little Elvis at the end there.
05:57.660: Thanks, Logan.
05:58.700: Yeah, I've been looking at this PNY thing for a while, and basically what it is, is it's a little SD card that is designed to actually fit in its entirety
06:10.860: Inside the slot.
06:13.979: So, in other words, it's not hanging out, and because it's not hanging out of the slot.
06:19.480: you can put it in the SD slot of your laptop and kind of leave it there.
06:23.720: So it's like adding 128 gigabyte or 64 gigabyte floppy, if you will, worth of storage.
06:30.639: I've been looking at these for a while.
06:32.240: I haven't plunked down the cash to try one.
06:35.440: Um, P N Y, I don't know anything about the company, so I don't want to plug them too hard.
06:41.360: But, you know, maybe they would be uh interested in um
06:45.480: talking with us or letting us know a little bit about that product.
06:48.120: Because I think that is kind of cool because let's face it, no matter how big your storage is in your laptop, they all we always seem to max that stuff out.
06:57.740: Now that being said, I want to make a comment about something that was said in last week's show.
07:05.020: And I'm just dawned on me that I don't have all the factoids, so I'm looking up some stuff as I say this.
07:12.580: But if you recall, and I know that some of you will recall more so than others, I was talking with Eric Wise about plugins.
07:23.320: And my general philosophy about plugins is that if you get too dependent on them, if you are a freelance editor and you have to move from machine to machine to machine
07:33.840: you're going to find instances where you are stuck without your plugins, and all of a sudden, you can't do all those great effects that you were doing someplace else.
07:46.000: Historically, I've really tried to avoid plugins, but one of the things that's been so great about Final Pet 10 is the proliferation and just the vast number of people that are actually producing them.
07:58.460: A good friend of the show, Alex Gallner, he makes these great little plug-ins.
08:03.820: And I think they're still all free.
08:07.100: I still say Alex should be charging for those, or at least asking for a donation.
08:11.639: But free plugins are actually a really cool feature of Final Cut 10 because if you do find yourself in a place where you don't have that plugin, well, yeah, go download it again.
08:22.220: Now, so here's what happened.
08:24.060: I made some some comments about Pixel Film Studio.
08:28.699: And in the wake of that show, if you will.
08:33.419: I got a few tweets.
08:35.019: Now I'm going to sc I'm scanning back here in the Tweeterizer here to find them.
08:40.940: Oh great, now they're not popping up.
08:42.620: Maybe they were on the other account.
08:45.260: Yeah, boy, there's a lot of noise on Twitter.
08:48.860: Okay, here's what happened.
08:51.340: I was talking about a plug-in called Pixel Film Studio.
08:55.820: It's a company and they make a lot of plugins.
08:59.260: After the show, I got a
09:04.160: Message from and I'm sorry I can't pronounce your name.
09:08.959: Well, I got a message from Alan C.
09:11.040: Wright and on the Twitter and
09:17.360: He started talking about it, and he gave me a link to an article written by, and here's the name I can't pronounce.
09:27.600: Simon, and it's S Z Y M O N.
09:31.360: I think it's pronounced Simon.
09:32.800: That's clever.
09:34.000: And Simon runs a company called Motion VFX.
09:38.300: Now, there was a very interesting controversy back in about January or February, and this goes back to the whole thing about we need producers.
09:48.260: Because this was really great.
09:49.700: I opened my big fat trap and just went, oh, this is awesome.
09:52.980: This is awesome.
09:54.340: And Alan Seawright feeds me this link written by Simon from Motion VFX.
10:01.980: And frankly, I don't know what to think of it.
10:06.540: I'm not a detective.
10:07.900: I'm not an investigative journalist by any stretch of the imagination.
10:12.940: But this is essentially the story that I heard.
10:15.660: Now, that being said, I would like to invite both Simon
10:20.779: And the people behind Pixel Film Studio.
10:24.060: And I apologize, I don't know your name.
10:26.140: I did read it in something, but again, I'm a horrible journalist.
10:29.180: Yeah, don't ever call me that.
10:31.740: But here's the controversy.
10:35.200: The two different companies, I don't even know if I want to get into it.
10:41.520: Anyway, yeah, I'll say it.
10:45.280: Simon from Motion VFX has a blog entry that accuses Pixelfilm Studio and has some very compelling evidence of actually purchasing their
10:59.060: Dust plug-in, rescaling, twisting, and otherwise modifying their footage, and then
11:09.340: Selling it, turning it around, you know, in a very short turnaround, but from when Simon released their dust collection.
11:19.240: And then Pixel Film Studio, a very short period later, released their dust collection.
11:24.360: Now, in one of the things that I read, and I have no sources for this, I apologize.
11:29.259: But in one of the things I read, the people from Pixel Film Studio claimed that or or stated that, um, well, they did some looking into it and they ended up
11:39.860: Letting somebody go, or somebody stepped, or one of their freelancers quit, or something, and they think that maybe that freelancer was taking some shortcuts in terms of producing content.
11:52.760: that was similar, if not exactly the same files from Motion VFX.
11:59.000: Now again, I would love to talk to Simon.
12:02.120: And again, Simon, I hope I'm pronouncing your name right.
12:04.839: I have a feeling I'm not.
12:07.780: And I would love to talk to the people from Pixel Film Studio.
12:11.140: That being said,
12:15.480: If somebody is literally just buying somebody else's content and renaming it and slightly modifying it and turning it around, you know, obviously that's not cool.
12:24.920: And it makes me really
12:29.980: You know, reticent to start supporting these people.
12:32.780: And, you know, and I said in the last episode, boy, I'd love to have them be
12:38.720: Be a sponsor.
12:41.040: But again, now there's this controversial story that was revealed to me.
12:45.920: And again, I am not accusing
12:50.140: Pixel Film Studios of doing this.
12:52.940: I am not accusing Simon of doing anything.
12:56.220: I'm just relaying things that I've heard.
12:59.060: Because I realize when you sit in front of a microphone, you're a very public figure, and there is a thing called slander.
13:04.820: And I don't want to be accused of slander or whatever the other word is.
13:08.660: And I know that one of them is speaking, and one of them is written, and I don't know which is which.
13:13.920: But at any rate, one of maybe one of our new producers could set me straight on that.
13:19.520: So
13:21.279: That's the deal with that.
13:23.519: I open invitation to both companies to come and talk about that thing.
13:29.079: That controversy.
13:31.000: So I will move on from there.
13:32.680: Next sound file that we have, and anyway, the last one was from Logan Highlands.
13:38.920: Let's go to the next one, and it is Lee Herbert.
13:42.140: From makeupyourmind.
13:44.780: com.
13:46.300: Speaker 3: Hi, Chris.
13:47.260: Speaker 3: My name's Lee Herbert, first-time caller, long-time listener.
13:50.540: Speaker 3: I've always wanted to say that, and I think I said that wrong.
13:52.940: Speaker 3: But anyway, love the show.
13:55.100: Speaker 3: I'm a Final Cut trainer and
13:57.300: Speaker 3: Editor from Melbourne, Australia, and I know a guy who I think would be great to have on the show.
14:03.380: Speaker 3: He's also a final cut trainer and editor.
14:05.700: Speaker 3: His name is Cedric Robinson.
14:07.700: Speaker 3: He was in the TV industry in South Africa for the longest time and is
14:12.060: Speaker 3: Recently moved to Australia and yeah, I think he'd be a really interesting guy.
14:15.420: Speaker 3: He's just started up his own certified Apple Training Centre here in Melbourne, teaching motion, final cut, logic, also the Adobe stuff.
14:23.860: Speaker 3: C um sort of four everything.
14:26.100: Speaker 3: Um yeah, so his name is Cedric Robinson.
14:28.100: Speaker 3: I think he'd be really interesting.
14:29.220: Speaker 3: You can just go check out labspaceaustralia.
14:32.180: Speaker 3: com.
14:32.660: Speaker 3: That's labs
14:34.700: Speaker 3: LAB SpaceAustralia.
14:37.019: Speaker 3: com.
14:38.380: Speaker 3: Yeah, also want to say that, like I said, really love the show.
14:41.260: Speaker 3: Premium Beats are awesome.
14:42.380: Speaker 3: I love them for some of the projects I've worked on and keep up the good work.
14:45.820: Speaker 3: Hope you're well rested from your road trip.
14:47.820: Speaker 3: Bye.
14:48.820: Isn't that cool?
14:49.860: The caller plugs the sponsor of the show.
14:52.580: I want to thank the guys from Premium Beat for sponsoring the show.
14:56.580: You know, maybe someday I'll have to start actually playing some Premium Beats on the show.
15:02.280: But there are there's at least one of my tutorials on their website.
15:07.480: More of those are coming.
15:09.240: And we really want to thank them for supporting what we're doing here and making the Grill possible.
15:15.740: So I implore you, please go check out PremiumBeat.
15:19.580: com, listen to their music, and you may find yourself addicted to it like I am.
15:25.240: Okay, so um Cedric Robinson, let's do it.
15:29.560: Let's hook that up.
15:30.920: I'd be interested in hearing from the mind of a trainer.
15:35.720: And besides that, Cedric, you lived in Africa and then moved to Australia, and so did my friend.
15:44.840: Gordon, who passed away.
15:46.920: Sorry, I keep going to that, but it's still fresh on my mind.
15:49.960: Next sound file from a good friend of the show.
15:53.320: This is Albin Eggers from Europe.
15:56.220: Speaker 4: Hey Chris, this is Alvan from Austria speaking, Alvan Ecker.
16:00.300: Speaker 4: Um I wanted to send you an email and then I thought that's so nineties.
16:03.740: Speaker 4: I used this voicemail which is
16:05.759: Speaker 4: Bleeding edge, this Oldsen Deb.
16:08.720: Speaker 4: Why I call you is because you mentioned that you do some recalls with people you had, and when you asked me about 10.
16:15.680: Speaker 4: 1.
16:16.760: Speaker 4: about 40 shows ago.
16:18.440: Speaker 4: Can you believe that?
16:19.320: Speaker 4: 40 shows ago.
16:21.640: Speaker 4: I said I couldn't add to that and now I think it is a lot of stuff.
16:24.920: Speaker 4: We do a lot of
16:26.020: Speaker 4: Same they added with the 10.
16:27.700: Speaker 4: 1 structure with Thunderbolt bridging.
16:31.300: Speaker 4: So we use two computers on one Thunderbolt bridge and that works great.
16:35.220: Speaker 4: It's a bit faster than the Ethernet we have.
16:38.580: Speaker 4: And so we could talk about that, how we use all this structure.
16:42.340: Speaker 4: And then something interesting is we have, as you remember maybe,
16:46.620: Speaker 4: uh digital signage product here where we use uh until now we used Windows and Linux to do all this, all the animations and and sending it out and managing all our players on the the hotels out in Europe in Europe.
17:01.120: Speaker 4: And now we're switching over to Mac, and one big reason is Final Cut 10 and the library structure and the ease of teaching Final Cut 10 compared to After Effects.
17:12.720: Speaker 4: So maybe we could talk about that.
17:14.320: Speaker 4: Maybe you're interested.
17:15.440: Speaker 4: Just hit me on Twitter or send me an email.
17:17.760: Speaker 4: You should have the address still.
17:19.200: Speaker 4: Wow, ninety seconds is fast.
17:21.120: Speaker 4: See you then.
17:21.760: Speaker 4: Bye
17:24.019: Yeah, Albin, that is something I really want to talk about.
17:26.740: I want to talk about your thunderbolt bridging.
17:28.580: That's something that Tony Galardo spoke about back on
17:31.820: Episode 19 that he was building a system.
17:35.580: And Tony's one of the people that I want to get back on the show and see how his build out has come.
17:42.380: Because I know they were buying four Mac Pros and
17:45.040: setting up a Thunderbolt bridging network.
17:47.680: So that's definitely something that we're going to look into.
17:51.920: I've never even done it once.
17:54.400: So it would be interesting to look into that.
17:57.760: And I know that
17:59.820: it's not a bad idea.
18:01.500: I know that if you recall, Stephen Luxic and I in Hawaii set up a little networked system, and we were just using Gigabit.
18:09.500: And actually, come to think of it
18:11.240: It was a nice, tidy little setup, short cable runs.
18:15.000: We could have done that with Thunderbolt Bridging.
18:17.240: And again, that's Steven Luxik back on episode 31.
18:21.640: Great.
18:22.860: I mean, I d I think I was really sick as I recall, and we had just finished a long edit.
18:27.340: So it's a little it's kind of crap.
18:30.600: You know, technically, but it's some good information in that show.
18:34.120: All right, next sound speak pipe sound file.
18:37.799: Let's go to Bryce.
18:39.960: I'm sorry, Bryce, I don't know how to pronounce your name, but Bryce from Cat3 Productions.
18:45.360: Chris, my name is Brace LeCar of Cat3 Productions.
18:48.560: My email is B-R-I-C-E at cat3productions.
18:52.160: com.
18:52.919: Just happened to listen to a couple of your podcasts and I really like it.
18:57.240: The one you were talking about, Bulletproof from Red Giant.
19:00.840: This software really is made for production, not post-production.
19:04.440: So when you're away from your your Edit Bay, you can start categorizing your footage.
19:11.399: Also, there's a great
19:13.440: Feature in there.
19:15.519: You can XML a folder structure right into FCPX so you do not have to redo everything a couple of times.
19:25.740: It's a software that is not mature yet, and there's more improvements that are coming down the pipe.
19:33.820: One that's going to be coming down pretty soon, I think, is the AVCHD.
19:38.980: Capability.
19:40.100: Anyways, I'll keep listening to your podcast and doing a great job.
19:43.940: It's very good stuff.
19:45.539: Thanks, Chris.
19:48.080: All right, Bryce, thanks a lot.
19:49.519: Thanks for that.
19:50.880: Very interesting what he said there about bulletproof being able to XML a folder structure right into Final Fet 10.
20:00.080: You know, one of the features that I heard and this is gonna you know, we're gonna talk about Final Cut 10.
20:05.840: 1.
20:06.480: 2 much more in depth.
20:08.960: And again, I'm still downloading, but I was talking with somebody, I can't remember, one of the one of the users that
20:14.640: Had downloaded it right away, one of the past guests.
20:19.040: But they said that you can now okay, so this is a little confusing without the visual assistance, but help.
20:27.360: So one of the things that helped me get over the keyword collections versus bins of Final Cut 7 sort of metaphor was
20:37.700: The simple act of saying, if I 'cause I I rarely use the import command.
20:42.660: I usually drag my media from the finder and drop it into my bins back in Final Fet 7 days.
20:48.820: I'd literally just drag it on top of the you know
20:51.840: You could have the bin open, you just drag it into the bin, and it is as though you have imported.
20:56.960: Now, that being said, in Final Cut 10, you can do the same thing, but what you cannot do is drag the
21:04.100: The media into the bin.
21:06.659: What you have to do, because there are no bins, you have to drag the media onto the keyword collection name.
21:13.620: So one of the changes in Final Cat 10.
21:16.179: 12
21:17.600: And I realize this isn't a giant thing, but I think you'll agree that it'll make it easier to teach people.
21:24.240: Is that if you have a keyword collection in your browser selected,
21:28.380: and in the field to the right of it where you would see all your clips, I can now actually drag media from the finder.
21:37.320: right into that field.
21:39.160: I don't have to put it onto I don't have to drag it onto the keyword collection.
21:45.400: So I can't really confirm that, but this is what
21:49.940: I was told by somebody, and uh I think that is somewhat interesting.
21:54.980: Now let me see.
21:55.779: Somewhere here I have a list
21:58.160: of some features which may or may not be totally worth looking at.
22:09.240: I'm from what I understand, there's a brand new VO tool, which includes some auditioning capabilities.
22:19.340: And that's actually really interesting because j literally just a week ago, I read somebody's tweet.
22:23.980: They go, Good grief, here's a feature of Final Cloud 10 I'd never even seen before, the VO tool.
22:28.780: And I was like, Okay, well, that's cool.
22:30.380: Now there's a new one.
22:32.220: I understand it works really nicely with XDCam with native support for that, I believe, is what I understand.
22:43.020: And I think one of the things that I'm looking forward to is that you can now adjust volume in new ways.
22:50.140: Now, back in Old Funnel Fit 7, I could select a clip.
22:53.160: I could hit a keyboard shortcut.
22:55.480: I could just type minus 4 dB enter and it would drop it from a relative
23:01.260: Relative to where it currently is, it would just drop it down four dB.
23:04.940: And from what I understand, that is now a capability in
23:09.200: Um final cut uh 10.
23:11.040: 12.
23:12.160: Uh I believe we're um we have 4K export to Vimeo.
23:18.480: Which s you know, I mean, I I'm not doing that, but I'm sure somebody is.
23:25.200: And let me think, is there anything else here on this list that I want to mention?
23:30.919: Apparently, there's I'm looking forward into looking at some of the new ways of filtering by used and unused clips.
23:40.380: So that'll be very interesting to take a look at too.
23:43.660: Still no Apple branded Michael J.
23:48.460: Fox signature model hoverboard, but we can always dream.
23:52.620: Anyway, um, this is not a long show.
23:55.660: Uh, I can't sustain this for too long by myself.
23:58.380: I'm much better at just chatting with people
24:00.840: But there were a few things here that I wanted to point out.
24:03.799: I want to introduce the idea of producers.
24:05.960: I want to ask all of you to help me set up interviews.
24:11.380: And help us it helps us all.
24:15.460: So we're going to wrap this up.
24:18.500: Again, thanks, Premium Beat, for being a part of this show.
24:22.340: And I sincerely thank all of the listeners for sticking with us for the last six, seven, eight months, whatever it's been.
24:29.620: And thank you for indulging me to take a few
24:34.720: Episodes off because let's face it, this is barely an episode to do my personal stuff.
24:41.440: I appreciate that, and I appreciate everybody's support.
24:44.160: I actually got some nice
24:45.640: Nice comments from people.
24:47.000: So that's it.
24:49.080: We'll be back on Friday with a real episode.
24:52.760: One of the upcoming
24:55.019: Interviews: We're going to do.
24:56.220: We're going to talk with Sam Mestman again.
24:58.460: He wants to talk about 10.
24:59.820: 12.
25:01.019: And I have a very interesting interview lined up with Joseph Lanaschke.
25:05.580: Joseph is a good friend of mine that used to work at Apple.
25:07.900: he now runs a website called Aperture Expert.
25:10.380: Now if you recall, last week, at the same time they were dropping 10.
25:15.340: 1.
25:15.580: 2, they were also literally dropping or announcing that they were going to suspend development of Aperture.
25:22.440: And this is a very interesting parallel between Final Cut Pro 7 and Final Cut 10.
25:29.399: And we are seeing a similar
25:32.240: Instance or a similar relationship, if you will, between Aperture and what Apple said that they were going to be releasing next spring, their new Photos app.
25:44.820: And I think the key thing to that is that Photos is designed to work both on the Mac and on the iOS.
25:52.940: although it feels very simplistic and iPhoto like, it actually has some very interesting and complex algorithms in terms of making its adjustments to images.
26:04.840: So, I think there's going to be a very similar thing that, like what we've dealt with, with everybody looking down their nose at us, going, Oh, iMovie Pro, blah, blah, blah.
26:14.740: I think there might be some similarity between that.
26:18.420: And I don't know.
26:19.060: I just want to talk to Joseph.
26:20.340: I you know, we love hanging out.
26:21.860: And so
26:23.060: I've been wanting him to get on one of the shows, and this is the best excuse I could come up with.
26:28.900: So, anyway, that will be coming up in recent shows.
26:34.580: We will talk to you again on Friday.
26:37.300: Thanks for listening.
26:37.900: Listening later, later.